@nina_kali_nina it was actually how i learnt the word "apropos"; well, yknow, coming across the command and then looking it up in a dictionary.

Oh no, wait, now i am telling you this story, i think it actually might be from "M-x apropos" from micro-emacs, a lightweight emacs-like that i used on the Atari ST.

@nina_kali_nina TILIF (today I learned I forgot)

@nina_kali_nina I'm lazy though and learned early on that man -k does essentially the same thing. So when man foo fails I just run it again with -k

@nina_kali_nina I know it in theory, but every time I actually need it, I have forgotten what the command is

@nina_kali_nina did you know whatis? it's apropos in reverse

@nina_kali_nina Also:
man info
info man
man bash

@nina_kali_nina Yes! I have also since learned that some Linux distros don’t install all the man pages for the software they install (or distribute them as separate packages - this is often the case with Perl). Apropos can’t help you if the man pages are missing! 😠

@nina_kali_nina Ooh, I didn't know this! Thanks for the tip.

Alt...

openSUSE server output, showing the results of the following commands: apropos cheese apropos video apropos render Only the last one has yielded any relevant man pages. The other two are not appropriate, apparently. ("Out of cheese" error, anyone?)

@csilverman @DrOinOR I always love your work. How many of these Notes illustrations have you done?

@eniko I do! I mean I never used the thing and never will, but your insights about it are very interesting and possibly even useful!

@eniko I don't think I ever used QBasic, but I did use its predecessor GW-Basic at high school.
For basics I was into Amos on the Amiga. Now that was a fun language. :)

@eniko I started with qbasic, it was a lot of fun making games and music in.

@eniko I learned how to program in QuickBASIC in high school, so it holds quite a bit of nostalgia for me. (And later Turbo Pascal!)

@eniko why do you love it

@eniko I fukken' love QBasic

@eniko ill talk up qbasic to anyone i can trick into listening

@eniko That I don’t care about it (either or) I think is the charm of it. The silliness of it is very human, and I like human.

@eniko I liked it. I'm short on energy for caring, but I liked it.

@nina_kali_nina My home page works with Lynx. Since 1994.

@nina_kali_nina all sites I use do.

• If a website doesn't work in #LynxBrowser over #Tor at #Iridium speeds, it's garbage and should be banned!

@nina_kali_nina Just checked that mine works in w3m and elinks. The only significant space for improvement is distinguishing the social media links from each other, I think

My website works in gemini, take that

@nina_kali_nina Yep. No Javascript, simple, non-essential CSS, and the personal markup language I write in requires alt text for all images.

@nina_kali_nina Probably not... then again, I haven't tried it. The HTML is proper semantic stuff so it wouldn't be completely catastrophic...

@nina_kali_nina i always build for links and mothra first 🦓

#links2gang

@nina_kali_nina My homepage and the omnibus? Yes. I'm not sure I have a favorite website. :thinking:

@nina_kali_nina@tech.lgbt Netsurf and elinks handle my favorite forum pretty well! Interestingly, elinks is better at interpreting the CSS, but the result is less readable than it would be if it didn't.

Dillo simply doesn't load a wide range of sites and shows no error message. slashdot.org, motherfuckingwebsite.com, and example.org as examples. Not sure why.

@nina_kali_nina because some adtech devs at the orange site told me that conversion is all that matters, and I should stop being a luddite and ship a 20+mb of LLM-generated JS PWA and a separate iOS app.

@nina_kali_nina The https://drahflow.name/pipe-organ.htm subpage doesn't render the 3D model in links, and only non-interactively in w3m, but clicking the part links works even better than I expected (FreeCAD auto-launched to show them). 🤷

@nina_kali_nina I use KaTeX, a JavaScript package, to render LaTeX on my site. I feel that it fails gracefully; browsers that don't run client-side scripts just display the raw markup.

I have a hunch that the intersection of folks who use browsers without JavaScript and folks who can comfortably read LaTeX markup is fairly broad.

@nina_kali_nina funnily, Dillo homepage doesn't work as expected in Dillo itself (content is not centered), so I have an incentive to implement support for "margin: 0 auto".

@nina_kali_nina almost. cover images don't work, i imagine because I only have them in webp or something

@nina_kali_nina My Migraine Log app exports HTML. I've tested them in dillo and netsurf. They work, but with degraded interactivity (interactivity is implemented without JS, so needs some recent-ish CSS selectors).

@nina_kali_nina My homepage works in anything with modern TLS support, and that's only because Netlify are highly opinionated on that front... One day I'll put it back on my own infrastructure and let you read pages with telnet if you want.

@nina_kali_nina

The stuff I code, yes. I use lynx a fair amount and if it works there, should be fine in a fancier browser like links or Dillo. I haven't used either of those in some years

@nina_kali_nina

My site:
✅ dillo
✅ lynx
✅ Netsurf

Favorite website(s), forum(s), and Mastodon instances?
❌ dillo
❌ lynx
❓ Netsurf

Why not? those sites don't care 😞

@nina_kali_nina my blog at https://thomaspurnell.com is mostly just notes for myself and it annoyed me that it wasn't accessible from my amiga, so i recently made some changes to the point where it's usable (though far from perfect)

@nina_kali_nina I could quickly install Links and Netsurf. Both work okayish.
When I set up my photo gallery https://matdroste.de I made sure to make the Hugo template NoScript-compatible, so Netsurf works just with an uglier layout, no slideshow, and for some reason no socials.
With Links the only bugs are double entries in the top menu and no socials, but viewing galleries by downloading single JPGs would be frustrating.

I installed links2 and it says "IFrame" where the navigation is, and it can be clicked on to view it, so yes, my website works in links2.

@nina_kali_nina oh humm... looks like animated webp support a no for Netsurf, elinks2 -g, and the most recent Dillo release. YouTube embeds predictably also non-functional.

@nina_kali_nina heck, I had to repeatedly complain to my bank so they'd fix their website to work with friggin firefox.

@nina_kali_nina my home page, yes, because I wrote it in HTML by hand in 1996 and haven't really updated it in the past decade or so.

@nina_kali_nina I recently made a website again and thought I'd try it in links, but that was not installed (and it's not my system so not up to me to decide whether it should be). So then I tried lynx, and concluded that it works, suboptimally, but it does.

@nina_kali_nina yes, no, no, n/a

And the other two made me think that I don't know if I even have a favourite website or a forum now :/

Does your home page work in Dillo, Links, Netsurf?

https://comam.es/what-is-snac

@nina_kali_nina I miss pre-12.16 Opera. Not sure if you count that as super-ancient or not, but it was my daily driver for probably over a year past its discontinuation

@nina_kali_nina Kristall, which will browse http(s), gopher, gemini, and finger ( https://github.com/ikskuh/kristall )

@nina_kali_nina

I voted for several, but there's only one I use regularly. I even have it installed on my Android phone. Yes, lynx works just fine in Termux and I have set the URL handler there to launch it

@nina_kali_nina
Amfora is really good! It only supports Gemini protocol instead of HTML, so way more niche than other browsers: https://github.com/makew0rld/amfora

Amfora and Lagrange are my preferred geminispace browsers. Lagrange can be found here: https://gmi.skyjake.fi/lagrange/

@nina_kali_nina I checked off the ones I used more than once, so mainly links, lynx, netsurf, and dillo. I'd consider the Goanna engined browsers like the Palemoon derivatives and K-Meleon to be pretty small/alt browsers as well.

@nina_kali_nina

Maybe:
* WebPositive (Haiku)
* Minuet (DOS) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesota_Internet_Users_Essential_Tool

@nina_kali_nina I used to work on #elinks when I was a student at University, twenty five years ago.

https://xteddy.org/elinks/

It was a lovely browser. Still is, as I believe it's still being developed.

Blast from the past!

@nina_kali_nina I *think* Chawan isn't a derivative of any of those? Not sure of its backstory.

@nina_kali_nina for years on my Atari I used CAB - https://atari.clauss-net.de/cab.html

@nina_kali_nina Not exactly a web browser but web apps.

https://c64os.com/c64os/worldexplorer/

https://c64os.com/c64os/c64ossoftwarereleases/

@nina_kali_nina wow, there are many more browsers (that I don't know) than I expected!

I like the Dillo UI. It’s just sad that most distributions ship it without TLS support.

@nina_kali_nina I remember using Amaya as a browser for a while: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amaya_%28web_editor%29

@nina_kali_nina Elinks forever in my heart, I will never forget the glory of tabbed browsing from the linux console, with images loaded straight to the framebuffer, and scripts to scrape video links and pass them to mplayer with fbdev

@nina_kali_nina Last I tried, the closest I got was w3m and elinks for the text based ones you mentioned. I basically just wanted images that scaled to fit the actual elements on the page in elinks as opposed to being something you clicked and it maybe displayed that separately. Browsh does what I'd want, but Browsh is also cheating by piggybacking off Firefox.

Servo is pretty dope in general, I'm hoping to use them for everything that currently works and just swap to Firefox derivatives for the stuff that doesn't.

@nina_kali_nina
Definitely going to look some of those up, now!

@nina_kali_nina
Is arachne fully open source these days? When I was using it, the situation was complicated.

@nina_kali_nina I would have liked to mention Konqueror, but that's also just Chromium (QtWebEngine) these days :(

@nina_kali_nina I use links somewhat frequently. Back around 2001 I'd use lynx on the real actual Linux console (SVGAtextmode for the win) and if I wanted to view a picture I could keyboard over to it and open it in zgv. Worked an absolute treat.

Lynx was also my very first Usenet client before I switched to slrn.

@nina_kali_nina #LynxBrowser is awesome!
https://tech.lgbt/@Netzblockierer/117165434446411988

@nina_kali_nina Mothra is peak web browsing. Didn't know microweb, looks cozy.
Offpunk is missing in the list!
https://offpunk.net/

@nina_kali_nina icab's been around for a while and is my backup

@nina_kali_nina Lynx is awesome but I like the cursor freedom and simplicity of w3m.

Lynx does have an absurdly good 3DS port, though.

@nina_kali_nina
Didn't remember any of them. But couldn't vote for none?

@nina_kali_nina wow, I feel proud of myself for getting a "seven out of ten"!

But I didn't know links and lynx were different things 😅 (although I *did* wonder why 'links2' was spelt with an 'i' rather than a 'y'...)

@nina_kali_nina

The question: Does the browsrr do Javascript?

@nina_kali_nina I was mildly interested in Ladybird until I saw it was all vibe-coded, which makes statements like this a bit baffling:

they will no longer accept public pull requests nor allow any other channels for submitting patches from non-maintainers, citing concerns about lower-quality contributions

Contrast with this statement from Servo:

Contributions must not include content generated by large language models or other probabilistic tools

@nina_kali_nina My single concern about alternative browsers is adblocking. That's a hard must-have for pages to load faster than 1200 bps.

@nina_kali_nina I think "edbrowse" would count as a small browser. http://edbrowse.org

@nina_kali_nina@tech.lgbt I could swear my site used to display well in Links, but it seems to just displays asterisks for the buttons now... and I specifically made that section a <ul> for semantic reasons ​​